BCMML OR CSSHL?

Discussion in 'WHL' started by Hotwheels, Nov 23, 2017.

  1. Hotwheels

    Hotwheels Registered User

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    I was not sure where to put this question and have found very little info comparing the 2 routes although the CSSHL has 3 options I suppose E15's, Midget Varsity and Midget Prep.

    Thought I could start a post in regards to peoples thoughts and opinion's on which is the best route and offers better developement. I tried to find results from the Ice Breaker Tournament which both leagues have attended the last couple years but could find nothing on it for this year.

    Guess I could start with my thoughts. From what I have heard BCMML and Midget Prep were very comparable in terms of teams matched against each other. Top Prep teams could wipe bottom BCMML teams and vice versa as of last year anyways. E15's is very developmental and saves 15yrs old's from getting hurt from playimng against older player's while they get stronger, faster and just generally develope a lot more than they would playing BCMML
    The other thing seems to be that Hockey Canada has for a long time been trying to push for the CSSHL Leagues and are apparently very supportive of the Canadian Sport School's as it is felt that the development is much better especially with a balance of school and sports as opposed to full time school and full time hockey evenings and weekends with homework and studying often taking a back seat along with some ridiculous ice times when students have school the next day?
     
  2. Skinnyjimmy08

    Skinnyjimmy08 WorldTraveler

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    Pretty comparable but I think BCMML is slightly better though. A lot of parents fork over the money to have their kids play Bantam at these academies for better showcasing and get them drafted. Once that happens, they don't really want to pay the 30-50 grand again in midget. Having said that though, many academies give extreme discounts to get these kids to come back and play midget just cause BCMML is a cheaper option and majority of kids get to live at home again

    Ive watched both leagues a lot and IMO BCMML is better... sure there are always a few TERRIBLE teams, but for the most part the league is better. Ive known a few parents that sent their kid to CSSHL in midget and regret it. They wished they would have not spent that money and just had them play BCMML
     
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  3. Hotwheels

    Hotwheels Registered User

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    Thank you for the reply. Do you have any idea on how the kids felt aBOUT leaving the CSSHL and playing BCMML? Did their school work quality drop?
     
  4. Skinnyjimmy08

    Skinnyjimmy08 WorldTraveler

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    Sorry Im not too sure
     
  5. Hotwheels

    Hotwheels Registered User

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    ok thx for the info you have provided
     
  6. Capitals03

    Capitals03 Registered User

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    So the draft is over and kids are going back home for some, and others looking at options.

    1. CSSHL or MML I think it would depend on whee you live and costs( not necessarily in that order)
    If I were at RHA, ND I would stay in CSSHL.
    if I were in Alberta, I dont think it would matter much were group you play for. Both are very good and deep leagues.

    The difference with BC is so many teams in a small radius. Yale,BWC,DHA, PCAHA,Shaw,West Van, St George plus Valley West, NW Giants,NE Chiefs, FV , GVC, Island Sivertips, Island Royals. Plus You have BC-MMM. So 14 Teams plus however many for BC-MMM. Way to watered down Then not to far is Kamloops and Kelowna.

    if WHL Drafted or if thats the way you want to go, I would do BC-MML or MMM. None of the BC teams will even be close to Alberta or even Winn or Sask for U15. Just to many teams and options.
    One CSSHL team has lost over 10 players, from the 2017-2018 season. I see this a high, but most will have 50% change. The CSSHL will have more none drafted players this year, but the new players will become better with the level of coaching and more ice time, and possibly get invites next year.

    So if not Drafted both groups are good, But I think they would get players more out from CSSHL.
     
  7. Hotwheels

    Hotwheels Registered User

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    Yes cost is definitely a factor.
    As for Academies you would stay at I am surprised you left out NAX with all the studs on their Bantam team last season.
    Yes Alberta, Manitoba, Sask. are a lot like Ontario with out door rinks and back yard rinks from the time you can walk where as most of the population in BC has to pay for every second of ice their kids get is a huge cost. I believe that makes a huge difference but I have been known to be wrong before. No pond hockey for 6 hrs a day on the weekends for kids here. Every elementary school I went to had an outdoor rink and my dad also made them in our back yard. I miss those days!!
    Although I have heard that most of the coaching is great in the CSSHL I have heard a few complaints as well which is nothing unsual. As for all the ice time and training I am unsure of how much is to much. It was definitely easy to see a lot of the teams burnt out and a loss of hunger for the game at some parts of the season especially with all the travelling but it is a reality if you want to play Junior as well as learning systems.
    The BCMML kids both minor and major will have full course loads but less training and hockey along with shorter distances to travel as compared to the CSSHL. I'm not sure what if any differences effects either league's players negatively or positively.
    So many teams in such a small area is a good point for sure!!
    I think the CSSHL U15 and new BC Minor ML could create a great rivalry if they are in some of the same tournaments together and it will also keep people honest.
    I would also like to see the BCMML and CSSHL Midget leagues compete in more tournaments together. It would be so nice to compare and probably great to watch but who know's.
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2018
  8. Capitals03

    Capitals03 Registered User

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    I included NAX with Alberta. I really do not see a huge different with Alberta for MML or CSSHL. Alberta has enough players in AAA and AA to make both pretty equal, Alberta is not over saturated with CSSHL Teams. So MML and MMM will be very good. Alberta any choice will be a good one, Unlike BC.
     
  9. Hotwheels

    Hotwheels Registered User

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    I find it interesting that you find Midget Hockey so bad in BC. CSSHL Midget Prep standings from last years regular season don't look to shabby to me for BC. Although the Vancouver area may have a lot of teams is the population difference not enough to warrant the number of teams? Or in your opinion is BC just a watered down cesspool when it comes to hockey in comparison to Alberta and that's that? I mean Notre Dame won it all at the Telus Cup. Lethbridge did well at the Telus Cup this past season with a full roster of Alberta boy's and BC did not make the top 6 they actually lost to Lethbridge 5-3 and 6-1 LOL
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2018
  10. Capitals03

    Capitals03 Registered User

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    I find it interesting that you find Midget Hockey so bad in BC. CSSHL Midget Prep standings from last years regular season don't look to shabby to me for BC. Although the Vancouver area may have a lot of teams is the population difference not enough to warrant the number of teams?

    The mistake is you know have 28 teams( 10-BC MML,10-BC MMM and 8 in CSSHL) going after 50 or 60 top 2003 players in Lower BC. They have never had that many teams in the past. You are correct for the tournaments. BC teams will not stand a chance. Just see how well they did in the Mac Tournament last year as you said.
    Alberta and the others have it correct and not a over abundant of teams.
    Look How many kids were drafted in BC. It was a low year for them. This is not going to be a fun year in MML for BC. Most of the strong 02's will make the jump to WHL or BCHL. So the middle of the pack 02's will also be depleted. What I did not know was that a 03 could not play MML if he was not drafted. That was somewhere on this site which I was unaware of.

    Some of the 03's will jump straight to U18 and some will go back to their home arenas. One CSSHL team has lost 10 players. I just think BC has done this wrong,
     
  11. Hotwheels

    Hotwheels Registered User

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    I love your use of numbers that makes perfectly good sense. Should interesting to see how it all pans out but yes it is looking very watered down with the number of teams.
    In the lower mainland Minor Hockey is finally trying to battle back against losing so many players to Academies. Some Minor Hockey associations were losing 9 top end players (for the most part) at a time and all of them from the same age group (1st year bantams). They are acquiring better people for development, more of it and I think alot of the "BBQ Clubs' are no longer a reason your kid makes an A1 team as opposed to a better kid that actually deserves it. Minor hockey here is still a few years behind the CSSHL in my opinion.
    I'm not sure there is gpoing to be anything anyone can do unless Minor Hockey just accepts that they are developing players who's families can afford it and some that can't, for Academies in most circumstances. Not sure that will happen but who knows?
    I have not heard this rule that you must be drafted by the WHL to play Major Midget as a first year? Doesn't really make any sense to me. There were 1st years playing Major Midget this past season who were neither drafted or listed by any WHL team. Wonder how the BCHL would feel about that unless of course BC Hockey and the WHL are in bed together for one reason or another. There does seem to be a larger number of players opting for NCAA from what I can gather.
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2018
  12. JPBHockey

    JPBHockey Registered User

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    I would like to see if there is an evaluation website of some sort for the current CSSHL teams from parents and players.
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2018
  13. Maddox

    Maddox Registered User

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    There should be, it would be a very informative resource for families considering CSSHL. Our experience as stated in another thread, was awesome, and we would recommend the CSSHL to families if that was the best fit for their son. That being said, there would be the pros and cons feedback as well. It would give families the opportunity to weigh the options out if they saw both the pros and cons. For instance, a simple example would be;
    CSSHL- no evenings consumed by practices = pro
    CSSHL- one school in particular, a lot of daily bussing and travelling due to geographical distances of school, arena and workout facility.= con
     
  14. JPBHockey

    JPBHockey Registered User

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    It's no doubt that CSSHL is the best league for the Bantam and E15 group, but I was talking about the feedback from recent families on the academies within CSSHL. I am sure there are few academies did not do what they'd said they would do in developing players, and only focus on building up their own academies. I think it will be awesome for some kind of evaluation done by the families who paid for the program and for CSSHL to hold the academies accountable. Most families I know did not want to bother filling out the end of year survey or be truthful about the survey collected by the academies. It would be a different story if CSSHL is involved in the survey study.
     
  15. Slats432

    Slats432 Registered User

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    A Midget AAA Coach in AB did a quick study.
     

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  16. Daximus

    Daximus Wow, what a terrific audience. Sponsor

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    If you are a top kid you might as well go CSSHL route. You're going to have access to a lot better facilities and training regimes and in the end you will benefit from the competition level. CSSHL is just getting started in regards to pumping out talent. Never have we had a league that allows for Western Canada to be as united. IMO the reason Ontario pumps out so much talent is because they have 13.6 million population whose kids play in extremely elite bantam and midget loops. You take the 11 million population of Western Canada and you put the top kids in an elite loop like the CSSHL rather then smaller more local loops and you will get elite kids like Ontario pumps out. The best way to have elite talent is to have the best play the best. You only become better by being challenged.
     
  17. Big Ben Healy

    Big Ben Healy Registered User

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    CSSHL is overrated imo.

    They're pumping out the best players because they sell a dream. Parents get to tell people their kid plays academy hockey. They're parents who think their kid is on the fast track to the NHL even if they're on the varsity team. People are getting hosed, all the top players used to play each other in club hockey and now they have to pay 30,000 to 40,000 per year?

    Club programs still meet prep schools in many tournaments throughout the year. Take kibiht for example, prep schools haven't had alot of success in the Tier 1 division and varsity teams get smoked in the tier 2 division.

    If a kid is good you don't need to spend that much to wear a cool academy Jersey.
     
  18. Capitals03

    Capitals03 Registered User

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    After seeing where players ended up and they league types. I would say that MML is a stronger league.
    U15 is pretty weak. The very good players are no where near U15. Some in U18. CSSHL is not bad. But for the money you are spending. MML is the way at least this year. IMO
     
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  19. Big Ben Healy

    Big Ben Healy Registered User

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    BC Hockey has a new minor midget league as well for 15 yr olds. This should make more players stay home and sway people back to club hockey.

    The price for academy hockey is insane.
     
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  20. Daximus

    Daximus Wow, what a terrific audience. Sponsor

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    I wonder if academy hockey is going to try a scholarship route to get top kids into the system. It would be smart on their part.
     

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