Injury Report: Dustin Byfuglien (Warning in OP)

Discussion in 'Winnipeg Jets' started by tbcwpg, Nov 2, 2019.

  1. tbcwpg

    tbcwpg Moderator

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    I posted in the last thread that we would re-open discussion about Byfuglien if there was some new, credible information - we got some on Hockey Night tonight.

    This is not a thread to discuss whether Buff is mad at management for defensive changes, is tired of Wheeler, or whether he's sold his house or taken his kids out of school. Any posts like "I heard a rumour that Buff...." without sourcing it will be warned and/or thread banned.
     
  2. LucianoBorsato

    LucianoBorsato Registered User

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    Huh? Why I added that he was an outdated old grouch? You actually can have an opinion on what someone's personality is (or at least the character they are trying to portray) AND acknowledge they do have knowledge on the subject due to their body of work.

    Personally, I enjoy hearing renowned hockey curmudgeons speak such as Watters, Bryan Burke and @sipowicz
     
  3. PaperRockChamp

    PaperRockChamp Registered User

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    Lol.. fair.
    Guys like Watters/Cherry still have value imo.
    Feel they are too easily dismissed because of their age.
     
  4. Mortimer Snerd

    Mortimer Snerd You kids get off my lawn! Sponsor

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    I really can't predict what an arbitrator might decide. I can say that if it was up to me I would probably agree that it is a hockey injury (subject to medical opinion). Once that is settled how should it go? Was there a date when Buff asked to be reinstated, or otherwise indicated that he is not retired? I think that at the very least, he would have to be paid from that date onward.

    This will take a while to be settled.
     
  5. DRW204

    DRW204 Registered User

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    wasn't it posted in one of the threads that Maurice knew that Buff had a fracture? He was talking about Ehlers' broken leg from the playoffs and mentioned Buff was dealing one too
     
  6. Arthur Fonzarelli

    Arthur Fonzarelli "aaaaay"

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    Yes. Maurice's exit interview 2019. So only 6 months ago.

    It was also pointed out on the Athletic by Aavco Cup in the comments section.

    It's also never been mentioned as to exactly what the arbitrator is ruling on, or has it?

    Could be the suspension wasn't valid. Could be regarding Buff's surgery and insurance coverage. Could be regarding Buff's salary. Could be the Jets fighting the fact the team may have $0 of LTIR available as opposed to the $6.5 million of LTIR they could have had because some hockey genius suspended Buff and left the Jets opening day cap hit at $75 million as opposed to the $81.5 million it would have been otherwise.
     
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2019
  7. Howard Chuck

    Howard Chuck HFBoards Sponsor Sponsor

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    I resemble that remark!

    :)
     
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  8. LucianoBorsato

    LucianoBorsato Registered User

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    As do I, or at least I am getting there :laugh:
     
  9. Howard Chuck

    Howard Chuck HFBoards Sponsor Sponsor

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    Outdated, old or a grouch? :)
     
  10. LucianoBorsato

    LucianoBorsato Registered User

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    outdated grouch, old part work in progress
     
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  11. Moon Man

    Moon Man Registered User

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    Lord knows what is going to come of this, but I don't think we should retire his numbers. Great player, but I don't know if he'll even make it into the HOF.
     
  12. kanadalainen

    kanadalainen A pint of dark matter, please.

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  13. Upperdeckjet

    Upperdeckjet Registered User

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    I don't believe Buff and his agent / NHLPA have filed for arbitration yet.
     
  14. JetsNut

    JetsNut Registered User

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    He may very well be unsuspended for not reporting but that won’t automatically entitle him to receive his salary.
     
  15. LucianoBorsato

    LucianoBorsato Registered User

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    No grievance filed yet according to Dreger on the radio @ 430
     
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  16. mouser

    mouser Business of Hockey

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    An interesting tidbit I stumbled across while researching a different issue in the CBA: Article 15.13(d)(i) states:

    15.13(d) In the event a Club grants a Player permission to be absent from Training Camp, the following rules shall apply:

    (i) A Player who has received permission to be absent from Training Camp will not be subject to suspension by the Club but will also not be entitled to receive Paragraph 1 NHL Salary while away from the Club;

    The rest of the language in section 15 seems to confirm that suspension is only done when the player was not granted permission by the club to be absent. This would suggest that while Winnipeg is reported to have given tacit approval for Buff to be absent, permission was not formally given under the CBA prescribed rules.
     
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  17. surixon

    surixon Registered User

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    I'm going to guess that they gave him a leave to miss a portion of camp. Once the duration of the leave expired and he didn't report they probably formally suspended him.
     
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  18. JetsNut

    JetsNut Registered User

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    That’s what I’ve gathered from what has been reported thus far.
     
  19. Jets 31

    Jets 31 Berdin is fricken hilarious Sponsor

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    Jesus , after Little getting hurt like he did we could sure use a statement like Buff will be back playing for the Winnipeg Jets as soon as he's healthy . Just a little positive news would be nice for a change . :help:
     
  20. Jimmyjets

    Jimmyjets Registered User

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    I know this is a super old post but I was just wandering through wondering if there was a deadline for the PA to file a grievance and came across it but your interpretation is wrong.

    The important thing to realize is that this clause speaks only about Training Camp. It doesn't talk about the regular season which is why Buff was only Suspended starting the regular season. That was so that his cap wouldn't count and he wouldn't get paid and is procedural as it's essentially an extension of the leave granted in the above clause.

    Anyhow, anyone know if there is a deadline they need to file this grievance by? It's been a couple weeks here.
     
  21. mouser

    mouser Business of Hockey

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    I would recommend you go back and reread the section, especially the final part on page 99. It discusses the regular season and even provides an illustration of how the player salary and cap hit is determined if the player misses part of the regular season after being excused from Training Camp.

    Also, the Jets suspended Buff on Sep 21st, nearly two weeks before the start of the regular season.

    Grievance filing deadline is 60 days after the event causing the grievance, or 60 days after a party becomes aware of some key fact contributing to the grievance. Without knowing exactly what the grievance would consist of, it’s possible the 60 countdown would be considered to have started well after the actual Sep 21st suspension. Such as when Buff had surgery, or became aware of some deficiency by the Jets.
     
  22. None

    None Registered User

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    For what it's worth Friedman said in his 31 Thoughts podcast last week that he thinks it's become more of an NHLPA vs NHL situation than Dustin Byfuglien vs Winnipeg Jets. He said that could be why the situation is frustrating for the Jets and responded to fans who are basically saying the Jets should just pay Buff saying the NHL won't allow that because it devalues the end-of-season physicals.
    Not necessarily because they don't want to pay him to just settle the issue but because the NHL feels that Byfuglien's side's claim would nullify the entire purpose of the end of season physicals.

    To me it outlines like this for the NHL's stance -
    1. Byfuglien was healthy at the end of season physicals. Byfuglien signed off on being healthy at that point.
    2. To say it's a hockey related injury takes a leap in logic to the NHL because he was healthy at the end of the season and never had it reassessed by the team.
    3. To question whether he was healthy is to question the finality of the end of season physical results.
    4. This could have repercussions league-wide if challenged successfully and that's why the league is involved.

    I think the NHL would argue that any leave of absence and subsequent suspension would be a separate grievance if Byfuglien informed the team that his request for the leave wasn't health related and he was considering retirement. The media hasn't given any indication that the suspension would be part of Byfuglien's complaint though, and Byfuglien's side really hasn't said anything during the entire process.
    To me this would make more sense as a complaint from Byfuglien's side, but then the question to me is how much can he recoup if it's deemed the process wasn't followed to properly assess whether his injury was hockey related.

    Another potentially overlooked point is that if it's deemed that the end of season medical is the last valid assessment for determining whether the injury was hockey related then the Jets and NHL could argue that the injury sustained and treated with surgery outside of team control would have made him unfit to play and therefore in breach of his SPC.
     
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2019
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  23. LucianoBorsato

    LucianoBorsato Registered User

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    Not exactly a Buff update, but Emily Byfuglien posted an Instagram video of their (I think) oldest son skating with some kids and Mick E. Moose at BellMTS Place today. So perhaps the overall relationship with TNSE is not nearly as fractured as has been conjectured, and it is more of an NHL vs NHLPA issue at this point, like @None pointed out in the above post.

    At the very least, the relationship between the Byfugliens and Mick E. Moose is rock solid :laugh:
     
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  24. Jets 31

    Jets 31 Berdin is fricken hilarious Sponsor

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    This is a good news post to me :hyper:
    If Buff was dead set on retirement why would the Byfugliens even still be in Winnipeg ? I guess they might not want their kids to change schools but i don't care , i'm taking it as good news , thanks Luciano . :thumbu:
     
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  25. Jets 31

    Jets 31 Berdin is fricken hilarious Sponsor

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    All i can say is if Buff gets 100% healthy and comes back to play sometime between now and the trade deadline , it will be Chevy's best trade he's ever made as GM. :laugh:
     
  26. LucianoBorsato

    LucianoBorsato Registered User

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    I'd think also if there was really, really bad blood their kids wouldn't be anywhere near the Arena
     
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